A reader writes in:"Someone registered in the 46th Ward should contact, in writing, by dated fax or by hand delivery with stamped receipt, the Chicago Board of Elections before the end of Tuesday Oct 7, 2008 to ask that all voters registered at the Tom Seay center (Salvation Army) be stricken from the registered voters list. This should be done to thwart the number of voters who will vote for Shiller’s referendum. It does no good to challenge at the polling place because a polling place challenge allows the vote to go in the ballot box and if the challenge is upheld a % is removed from that voting place’s vote. It does not change the relative distribution of that vote."
Are our readers up for the challenge? The clock is ticking. The address for the location in question is 1025 W. Sunnyside. Might be worth a try.
UPDATE: The Salvation Army apparently realizes, like just about all Uptown residents (except Alderman Shiller), that the concentration of social services and low-income housing in one neighborhood isn't a good thing, and the closing of the Tom Seay Center reflects that. From the S.A. website about the Center closing: "As the homeless population has become more dispersed throughout the city, it’s clear that a new strategy is needed."
UPDATE #2: This link to the Board of Elections lists fax numbers and phone numbers you can contact regarding this issue.
UPDATE #3: Check out the sidewalk in front of the former Tom Seay Center as seen this afternoon. Something is missing.
.jpg)
This sounds unconstitutional.
ReplyDeleteWhat's the basis/argument for striking these voters/registrations?
ReplyDeleteWhat sounds unconstitutional? That people are registered to vote from an abandoned building? That someone could challenge that?
ReplyDeleteI too am curious what the basis here is. this is a pretty serious thing to attempt to do.
ReplyDelete"This sounds unconstitutional."
ReplyDeleteIt's not.
"What's the basis/argument for striking these voters/registrations?"
It's a vacant property.
"I too am curious what the basis here is."
Every ineligible vote nullifies an eligible vote. This is voter disenfranchisement by another name. This is a civil rights matter. Stand up and protect your civil right to vote. Stand up and fight attempts to disenfranchise your vote.
Do we have an informed reader here about voter registrations? I've always wondered how the homeless register. I have an address, one address, which is my registration. If I have no address can I register at every shelter in the city? Could I be registered at every shelter in Uptown and cast several votes for Helen and her pet projects?
ReplyDeleteAs a voter registrar, I know that people have to give a valid mailing address in order to register to vote.
ReplyDeleteThe little cards we get in the mail every couple years to confirm we still live at the registered address are sent to ensure that the address is still valid. If it's not, then the people registered there are stricken from the voting rolls.
Unless the Salvation Army is still receiving and distributing mail to their clientele at the Tom Seay address (and based on the photos of them packing up the furniture and filling dumpsters with trash, I don't think they are), these people are no longer registered at a valid address.
An anology: If you lived in Wilmette and were registered to vote there, then Wilmette found toxic black mold in your home and tore it down so you had to move and find another place to live ... would you still be entitled to vote in the next Wilmette election using the toxic black mold address?
Ah.
ReplyDeleteWell, that just ain't right.
Wonder if Steans and Harris would be interested in something like this (not to mention Jan .. since she is up for re-election, this go-round)?
Still - a little strategy would help, here. Not just one registered voter in the 46th needs to do this, many need to do this to get the attention of the Board of Elections.
So ..., to admit my ignorance, what's the next step?
It seems to me that if the Alderman goes through such lengths to have the homeless register at shelters in order to maintain an advantage, that she's probably going to pick them up at other locations.
ReplyDeleteI'd be interested in how many votes come from the shelter addresses. Does anyone have an idea of how to access that information?
Has anyone here heard of ACORN? They are active in registering voters throughout the Midwest. They are active in Ohio right now and their voter registration forms are being challenged. Many of them are invalid.
ReplyDeleteACORN's problem is they pay staff PER REGISTRATION. Naturally, staff will make stuff up to boost their compensation.
I don't know how active ACORN is in Uptown, but they are the biggest voting registration pusher on the South Side. And by far the biggest in Illinois.
ACORN staff has registered voters to YMCA addresses, animal shelters, and vacant properties.
Alderman Shiller is a soldier of "The New Left". Her supporters are firm believers in "The New Left". They don't care about the means. They only care about the ends.
They are followers of Saul Alinksy. Alinksy preached that it's perfectly fine to lie to achieve your goals. Cheating is welcome too.
I think i may have mentioned before that a bunch of the people here who were concerned about suspicious voters like these people, the gangbangers with no "real" address in the neighborhood, etc. should think about registering as election judges to check records and keep everything on the up and up. Is it too late?
ReplyDeleteHere's an interesting article for those wondering about the voter activity of Uptown's homeless.
ReplyDeletehttp://flyingdebris.blogspot.com/2007/02/could-this-possibly-be-legal-chicagos.html
An interesting quote from the article: "Every homeless shelter in the 46th ward has voter registration numbers in the 95% to 100% range making those lost homeless people in Uptown among the best organized voters in the United States."
People who don't have a home are entitled to vote. They have to give an address where they can receive mail, so many of them register at homeless shelters or soup kitchens.
ReplyDelete- Ald. Shiller is very active in making sure everyone in her ward has an ID so they can more easily register to vote.
- For the 2007 election, there were 177 people who were registered to vote using the Tom Seay address.
- There's a sign on the closed Tom Seay Center suggesting that if someone needs a mailing address, he or she use the currency exchange at Montrose and Broadway.
You can only vote in one ward and you must actually live in that ward if you are voting there. Vacant buildings are not considered valid home addresses. I know there has been a concerted effort to get around this law, but it is the law.
ReplyDeleteCONTACT THE BOARD OF ELECTIONS to alert them of this issue.
Are mailing addresses like PO boxes valid?
ReplyDeleteDoes the Currency Exchange allow people to use their business as a mailing address like this?
Frank, so you're in favor of letting people vote who give abandoned buildings as addresses?
ReplyDeleteA requirement that people live in a traditional dwelling in order to vote placed an unconstitutional constraint on the voting rights of homeless persons. Coalition for the Homeless v. Jensen, 187 A.D.2d 582 (N.Y. App. Div. 1992).
ReplyDeleteStates should use a broad interpretation of the term “residence” to include any place, including a non-traditional dwelling, that an individual inhabits with the intent to remain for an indefinite period. Pitts v. Black, 608 F.Supp. 696 (S.D.N.Y. 1984); In re-Application for Voter Registration of Willie R. Jenkins, D.C. Bd. of Elections and Ethics (June 7, 1984).
When registering to vote, homeless people may designate a shelter, park, or street corner as their residence. Fischer v. Stout, 741 P.2d 217 (Alaska 1987).
www.nationalhomeless.org
I think this thread is pretty sad.
Hey Kenny, all of the cases you cited are NOT Illinois cases and are NOT binding on Illinois. If you are trying to make a point you should at least be upfront about it and not try to guide people to laws of other states.
ReplyDeleteVoter fraud needs to be prevented. I have no issue with any voter who is legally registered to vote in compliance with Illinois law. I do, however, have a big problem with people who try to break the law and those who try to mislead others regarding applicable case law. Quit being deceptive, Kenny.
I think this thread is pretty sad.
ReplyDeleteI think election fraud, and those who support it like you are sad. Maybe I just a special place in my heart for Democracy.
This isn't a new issue. (is it?) I would think a lot of intelligent people have put some thought into it. If the homeless don't have to provide any real info, why would anyone else? There must be some mechanism for ensuring any person gets one and only one vote. What is it? Anyone? Buehler?
ReplyDeleteSince 1992, when the law was passed in Illinois, homeless people in this state can register to vote using the address of a shelter, a church, etc. any place where they receive mail.
ReplyDeleteThe three court cases are not unlike the law that was passed in Illinois, however, I can't find the exact statute just now.
and frankly, I'm much more concerned about homeless people (or anyone, for that matter) having their contsitutional right to vote being "thwarted" for political purposes than I am about any potential voter fraud.
The shelter does have to be open in order to use it as a valid mailing address. Given the history of voting in this ward, I am very concerned about voter fraud used to promote a certain candidate and to promote a political agenda.
ReplyDeleteUsing the homeless as pawns to win an election is nothing less than pathetic.
Right, Kenny, as I said above, homeless people have the right to vote if they register at an address where they can receive mail. They cover this very clearly in the voter registrar classes in Chicago. Those of us who register people in the 46th Ward were given special attention to make sure we understood it.
ReplyDeleteThe key phrase in this particular case is "an address where they can receive mail."
It's up to the Board of Election to decide if an abandoned building where over 175 people are registered to vote qualifies as a valid address.
Using the homeless as pawns to win an election is nothing less than pathetic.
ReplyDeleteIs she promising them something in return for their vote, whether or not it actually happens?
Congratulations, that describes just about every politician there is, was, or ever will be.
So I guess that means we're ALL "pawns" for some politician or another.
If you suspect voter fraud by Shiller, then go after Shiller.
But as Tom Seay was just recently closed, I would imagine those registrations have been transferred to another shelter in the ward/precinct -- they didn't just vanish into thin air as some of you obviously wish -- and that's what's so sad about this thread.
10 ILCS 5/3-2
ReplyDelete(a) A permanent abode is necessary to constitute a residence within the meaning of Section 3‑1. No elector or spouse shall be deemed to have lost his or her residence in any precinct or election district in this State by reason of his or her absence on business of the United States, or of this State. Nothing in this Section shall be construed to prevent homeless individuals from registering to vote under the provisions of this Act.
(b) A homeless individual must have a mailing address in order to be eligible to register to vote. For purposes of this Act, a mailing address shall constitute a homeless individual's residence for voting purposes. A mailing address of a homeless individual may include, but is not limited to, a shelter, a day shelter, or a private residence.
Election authorities may by reasonable rules limit the place where voter registration of homeless individuals may be taken and the class of deputy registrars who may take the voter registration of homeless individuals.
(c) Nothing in this Act shall be construed to confer upon homeless individuals any additional privileges or benefits other than the right to register to vote and to be qualified to vote in an election under Articles 4, 5, and 6 of this Code.
I have to agree with Kenny on this one. It is not our place to infringe on the right to vote that the homeless have.
ReplyDeleteBut election and voting fraud is a big deal, too, especially when unethical tactics might have been used and are being used to register individuals, place false votes, etc.
At the very least maybe this post with force a lot of us to brush up on the laws and our rights here in the 46th War when it comes to elections and keeping them transparent and honest.
Also, anyone can campaign for their candidate at shelters and on the street, so don't think the homeless and others can't be solicited by you if you are passionate and campaign for someone!
and that's what's so sad about this thread.
ReplyDeleteHold on, you're a Shillerite and you're twisting people's words? Amazing! Now all you need to do is start working that racism angle.
But as Tom Seay was just recently closed, I would imagine those registrations have been transferred to another shelter in the ward/precinct -- they didn't just vanish into thin air as some of you obviously wish -- and that's what's so sad about this thread.
ReplyDeleteVoter registrations don't automatically "transfer" to another address. Each voter must reregister. That's the law.
Sad or not, that's up to you.
Let's all send the letters to challenge voters to use the address. Let's not just debate the issue. Let's see the results of the challenges.
ReplyDeleteHold on, you're a Shillerite and you're twisting people's words?
ReplyDeleteI know if may be hard for you to understand in your all/nothing way of thinking, but I'm not a "Shillerite." And I don't think a lot of twisting is necessary to see the intent here.
Kenny, I am glad you have seen the light. Yes, the intent of the post is to make sure that voter fraud is prevented. Thank you for your support!
ReplyDeleteIt really doesn't seem like Shiller's questionable voter-support tactics are the major issue here.
ReplyDeleteIt would be nice if she got caught for voter fraud, but we can't hold our breath can we?
I can't tell you how many condo owners and young people I've talked to in the neighborhood who simply didn't vote in the last aldermanic election - because they would have never guessed an alderman could be so damaging to a nieghborhood's progress (Of the 15 people who live in our building, only 4 of us actually took the time to vote against Shiller in the last election).
Now that the economy has slumped. Housing values in Uptown have dwindled - while crime has gone up - well, it seems there's a lot of people who know of Shiller, and see her as an enemy. Proof of that is the 400+ turnout for the neighborhood crime meeting earlier this summer.
There's a lot we need to do by 2011 (the next chance to rid the ward of her). The hard part is already accomplished - people are engaged in the issue, the collective despise for Shiller couldn't be anymore apparent. Translating that frustration into voter registration and actual votes is the next bit of strategy someone needs to workout.
Not sure if I'll still be living in Uptown two or three years from now - but, I might try to sneak a vote in against her (it only seems fair) :)
OK, I get it now, I think.
ReplyDeleteI am not opposed to the homeless voting, however they need to follow the law just like everyone else.
I suspect that the suspicion here is that Helen or someone representing Helen is "buying" votes. How much for a homeless vote? 5 bucks?
Why not go out and buy the votes back, or better yet, find out if they were in fact given money to go and register to vote.
Or, something more legal, why not host a neighborhood benefit in one of the parks and invite the homeless. give away free chili, soup, or something else that is easy and cheap to make a lot of. While they are there, spend time talking to them about the neighborhood and this referendum I suspect the truely homeless don't want gangbangers on the street any more than we do. Anyhow, its just a crazy idea.
"Why not go out and buy the votes back, or better yet, find out if they were in fact given money to go and register to vote."
ReplyDeleteWhat can you prove in court?
Challenging the votes is actually the path of least resistance. The alternatives are worse.
Uptown has plenty of other shelters, they can use their registrations in other precincts. Helen can probably still get 3 or 4 votes from each.This is Chicago after all.
ReplyDeleteStay on topic and do not play the "race card."
ReplyDeletePeople who registered at Tom Seay (Salvation Army) will not be disenfranchised. Their vote will count for this election.
ReplyDeletePeople who registered at Tom Seay (Salvation Army) will not be disenfranchised. Their vote will count for this election.
ReplyDeleteHow do you know this?
If the place that you list as your residence is no longer a residence, then it cannot be valid for the election. Given that the Seay building is vacant, and will be vacant at the time of the election, it should NOT be considered a legal residence for the upcoming election. The point of this requirement is to make sure that people live where they say they live.
ReplyDeleteThus, if someone went to vote in Novemeber and stated that 1025 W. Sunnyside was his/her current address, then he/she would be providing false information.
On the 46th ward ballot:
ReplyDeleteAffordable Housing TIF - Ward 46, Precincts 8, 12, 20, 22, 23, 26, 32,
38, 41, 42, and 47
Should the City of Chicago allocate 40% of TIF funds (Tax Increment
Financing) to preserve and produce housing affordable to persons at or
below the community median income, including acquiring vacant or
foreclosed-upon properties, rehab and construction?
Yes _____
No _____
Public Subsides (TIF) - Ward 46, Precincts 8, 12, 20, 22, 23, 26, 32,
38, 41, 42, and 47
Should the City of Chicago adopt a policy whereby beneficiaries of public
subsidies (including TIF) with more than 15 employees must give local
residents first chance to apply for jobs, certify that all employees and
contractors' employees receive a living wage and pledge to honor worker
rights, including safety standards and the right to organize without
interference?
Yes _____
No _____
I don't have a problem with the part that says people who benefit from TIFS have to hire locally, but the rest is bad news.
ReplyDelete1025 W Sunnyside is in the 47th precinct...it seems pretty obvious to me this was specifically engineered by Helen to skew the referenda votes.
ReplyDeleteI just spoke to the Chicago Board of Elections and asked what happens to all the registered voters when a shelter closes and the address listed on their registration is no longer their home address. The supervisor said anyone whose address is registered as the shelter can vote in this election. After this November election, they will have to reregister at their new address in order to vote.
ReplyDeleteI appreciate everyone who has compassion for the homeless and defends their rights. However there is little doubt that HShiller has broken the law and been dishonest throughout her political career. Why shouldn't honest people pursue (what is within their legal right) this issue to ensure the voting rules are being upheld? I mean, if a voting majority (who vote against Shiller) lose out to in 2011 because she is partakes in under-the-table tactics, it would be way worse than a few disenfranchised voters.
ReplyDeleteIf what bp neighbor posted is true, look for a record number of voters to turnout using 1025 W. Sunnyside as their address. Shiller's referendum is sure to pass.
ReplyDeleteCaring Neighbor-
ReplyDeleteI called the Chicago Board Of Elections.
So Shillsgangs is sort of right, but totally wrong concerning the election in November 2008.
what kind of campaigning against this referendum is being done in these precincts? We can be mad about it all day long, but whats done is done. What can we do to defeat it? Is it important to defeat it?
ReplyDeleteSomeone mentioned ACORN.
ReplyDeleteACORN is a crooked legalized mafia who shakes down companies and business for money. They skirt the law to intimidate people.
Oh, just so happens that their former “leadership trainer” is Barack Obama.
http://article.nationalreview.com/?q=NDZiMjkwMDczZWI5ODdjOWYxZTIzZGIyNzEyMjE0ODI=&w=MA==
More crooked Chicago politics. This should be fun!
I take it then, uptowngirl, you'll not have a problem with my friends and me getting a few shelter residences (real or imaginary) and making the rounds voting?
ReplyDeleteThis is hilarious. I live in Mary Ann (Alderman for Life) Smith's ward. Since voting in aldermanic elections in the 48th is a complete waste of time, I'll just "move" to a shelter in Uptown and vote for any opponent of Shiller's.
ReplyDeleteBradley-
ReplyDeleteYou can do whatever you want, but sadly your vote won't count this November.
Good luck next time!
I've got until tomorrow and then there's the grace period. I could still become one of your coddled criminals.
ReplyDeleteI had not considered this "address where you can receive mail" option to register new voters, but this seems ripe for rampant exploitation.
ReplyDeleteAll I need is a mailing address that will receive mail for my name?
Couldn't I just register bus loads of people from the suburbs as long as they can receive mail at an address inside the ward?
Yes. Yes, you could. The homeless woman who is now in jail for attacking someone at a liquor store in the South Loop, and who gave her address as the Pacific Garden Mission, is a registered voter in Uptown. At a social services agency.
ReplyDeleteI know who you are Uptown Girl. I also know caring neighbor and she ranks right under you right now.
ReplyDeleteBy the way Uptown Girl you sat right next to Mr. Trott at the Town Hall.
Chip-
ReplyDeleteIm not scared if you know who I am. I would love to meet you. I have plenty of friends who don't always agree with me, but we manage.
Uptown girl, I could not definitively say what the board of elections would do, only what they should do under the circumstances. We do live in Chicago and have seen an inordinate number of curious decisions with respect to the voting process.
ReplyDeleteIf you cannot prove that you live in the ward, you should not be allowed to vote in the ward. We should be able to agree on that issue, right?
I have found that sometimes when you ask for more clarification, things change. If someone from the Board of Election says it's perfectly fine for the homeless to use an abandoned building as their address in order to vote this time around, ask them to show you the documentation that allows this particular exception for this particular time. When it's admitted that no such ruling exists, then it can be challenged.
ReplyDeleteUptown Girl....what are you standing next to in that picture? Just urious.
ReplyDeleteOops, just curious.
ReplyDeleteIt is a stone wall located near Lawrence and Dover. You can see it when driving down Lawrence.
ReplyDeleteDeny people the right to vote? Because they are homeless? Who are the Nazi's advocating this? Let me guess, yuppies who couldn't afford to buy in Lincoln Park and took advantages of the low cost of buying in Uptown and now want to turn it into Lincoln Park so they can have more money! Where are the homeless to vote?
ReplyDeleteSean - no one is denying anyone the right to vote. As stated above, it is only fair to be able to vote in this ward, if you live in this ward - homeless or not.
ReplyDeleteYou can thank Helen Shiller for the skepticism anyone has in regards to the 46th Ward voting process.
I guess sean that I'm one of the "nazis" who wants to deny people the right to vote more than once. But actually, I just want to deny Helen the opportunity (definitely not a right) to import people with no vested interrest in this ward to vote for her and her pet projects.
ReplyDeleteMiss Kitty and Bradley....Where is the proof that Shiller is importing anyone to vote in her ward? And where do homeless transients 'live' anyhow? Homeless have the right to register according to their mailing address, the same as you. Their voter registration cards are sent to that address. They have a right to vote where they are registered and only there. One person one vote. What are these pet projects you are whining about Bradley, projects to help the least of our brothers? How long have you been living in Uptown? I am quite sure the homeless and poor have been there much longer, which is exactly why so many of the haters posting here are able to afford Uptown. But once y'all get in it is all Get them out of my back yard! Who cares what happens to them, just move them.
ReplyDeleteHuh Sean, got some big news for you there buddy. The homeless come to Chicago from other parts of the city. They rarely originate from Uptown. That's the whole point, isn't it? It isn't appropriate to have one neighborhood take on the burden of caring for the homeless from other parts of the city. Now Sean, what's up with you trying to perpetuate the myth that all the homeless in Uptown always lived here?
ReplyDeleteNo one said the homeless shouldn't register to vote. However, they should be following the law and not use an address that's abandoned. No mail comes to this building anymore and the homeless were warned many months ago to change their mailing address. If they didn't do it, then they face not voting. I realize accountability can be a real bummer sometimes, but it really does help us become more responsible. You mom taught you that, right?
And Sean...why do you suppose the referenda are only on the ballot in precincts they are? Yes I'm a bit of a cynic regarding Helen's motives but she hasn't really left me with much choice given her clandestine (as opposed to transparent) ways. You mostly proved my point. Since noone's receiving mail at 1025 Sunnyside and you seem to think they should still be able to vote from there. Can they also vote from wherever they are receiving mail?
ReplyDeletePerhaps I'm being a tad paranoid but again, Helen's ways do nothing to allay the state.
It seems to me that what has triggered a bit of the animosity on this thread are some people's overarching concerns about voter disenfranchisement. It looks to me that some people read the post and viewed this purely as another effort to once again disenfranchise the homeless, the poor, minorities, etc. When I first read the post, I must admit that a few hairs stood on end with that concern.
ReplyDeleteHowever the language of the post was very clearly directed toward the issue of the legality of voter registrations in this one precinct that is allowed to vote for Shiller's referenda. (Expect more from me later about how blatantly wrong it will be for her to claim ANYTHING using such a skewed approach and such poorly written language...but I digress...)
So even though everyone should concede that the registered voters at Tom Seay need to be re-registered or, unfortunately, lose their right to vote some people have chosen to descend into the muck. Sean says:
How long have you been living in Uptown? I am quite sure the homeless and poor have been there much longer, which is exactly why so many of the haters posting here are able to afford Uptown. But once y'all get in it is all Get them out of my back yard! Who cares what happens to them, just move them.
Well, Sean, I am certainly not a "Nazi." They wouldn't let my kind in their party. What I am is a person of modest means (because I have chosen a career that contributes to the public good and leaves me time for artistic expression). I moved here because I didn't want to live in Lincoln Park even if I could have afforded it. But I have learned that I am not welcome here and that in Shillerista land I don't deserve my civil liberties simply because others have had them denied. Its crazy and wrong and if you want to talk about NAZIs...well I think that was THEIR approach: return what was "stolen" to the the "people" the "folk" the "pure".
Keep your bastardizations of social justice to yourself. Equal treatment under the law for ALL.
Hey Sean, any thoughts about what was said? I've come to know your type quite well. Silence and then a repeat of the same tired & flawed argument when the subject pops up again.
ReplyDeleteHey friends of chane. It is coming. Property values will increase, crime will lower. Your representitive will soon rear his head.
ReplyDelete