Our neighborhood gangbangers decided to have a shootout across the intersection of Wilson and Malden at around 3:30 [time corrected] this afternoon, while traffic and pedestrians were present.The Uptown Crime Blotter was, inadvertently and unfortunately, in a prime position to cover the story, as one of the bloggers happened to be driving past and was nearly hit by gunfire.
Anyone else ready for these gang thugs to get the hell out of Dodge?
I don't know about anyone else, but I am at my wits end with this stuff. The governor is responsible for defunding "cease fire," the mayor chooses to believe that these are isolated incidents and that all cities will have crime, the alderman takes the same position and adds allegations of rampant police misconduct, and the beat cops are angry about Weiss and the fact they still don't have a contract yet. Finally, any meager thing people try to do around here (rallies, positive loitering) usually devolves into accusations that the participants are merely trying to rid the neighborhood of all poor people.
ReplyDeleteHave I overlooked something? This is one of those occasions when I hope someone will try to prove me wrong. Gun violence is bad for everyone in this community. Why in the world is it so freaking hard to get some consensus around the issue so that we can do something about it?
This is horribly scary. Unloading their guns when they're across the street from eachother. Imagine the traffic, car and pedestrian. It is amazing to me that noone gets caught in the cross fire.
ReplyDeleteI agree with saskia, this needs to stop. Gun violence in the neighborhood is not good for anyone. Hopefully someone got a good discription of the shooters and was able to give it to the cops. OR will they say something like, that's a great discription but we can't prove anything because we didn't catch them in the act. Hopefully not...
Weis was too busy telling the City Council that he's going to ask other cities how they handle their crime. I mean, just because we're Chicago and all doesn't mean we have to know how to handle our problems.
ReplyDelete2:30 in the afternoon... Their brazeness says a lot about who's in control.
And the alderman's statement and reaction to the escalating gang violence?
ReplyDeleteGee, I seem to hear a pin dropping.
My disgust with the gangs is seconded only by my disgust with Ald. Shiller doing her ostrich impression.
Don't forget a mayor that thinks that keeping regular citizens unarmed is the best way to keep crime down. If handguns were legal and Illinois had an open or concealed carry law would the gangbangers be as willing to open fire on a busy street?
ReplyDeleteThis is from Uptown Dad, sent at 5:38:
ReplyDeleteI heard the shots, called 911. it was at 3:26.
About 9 shots, gang bangers were ducking and covering around sunnyside.
I went out and pointed the guys I saw out to the cops.
Officer said.."No arrest are being made because no one was hurt and no property damaged."
15 minutes later I saw one of the perps walking down Malden and pointed him out to the police. 5 minutes after that he is walking back down the street. I was playing football with some kids on Sunnyside at the time.
FYI one of the gangs main drug dealers is driving around the area with a rusted maroon late 70's model cutlass or plymouth with plate # X38 7601
Im off UU for a while. I need a break from the trolls and the grammar police. Keep up the good work folks. I think UU is a good thing. When the trolls clear out I will be back.
All the best.
-Ryan
aka Uptown_Dad (one of many)
Oh .. Somone Jumped in the Train Tracks at @Argyle N Broadway couple minutes ago
ReplyDeleteOfficer said.."No arrest are being made because no one was hurt and no property damaged."
ReplyDeleteImagine if this same situation happened on a plane or in an airport. Do you suppose the Feds would say, "No arrest are being made because no one was hurt and no property damaged."
It's almost as if they are challenging the community to file a class action lawsuit against the City for punitive damages or plead our case that this is a form of domestic terrorism with full cooperation of the police force and the Alderman.
Once again. Uptown has never been a safe place for regular folks to live and it appears it's not going away anytime soon. Possibly a cop on very street corner??
ReplyDeleteIt's almost as if they are challenging the community to file a class action lawsuit against the City for punitive damages or plead our case that this is a form of domestic terrorism with full cooperation of the police force and the Alderman.
ReplyDeleteThat is an interesting comment. How viable would something like that be? Not that I would try but I guess the official reaction means that I could sit on my porch and start shooting a gun and as long as I didn't cause any damage I wouldn't be arrested? Whatever happened to reckless endangerment with a firearm or whatever that charge is?
To me, it is most alarming that such a high percentage of the gang violence is in such a small geographic area. Obviously, there is other violence in Uptown, and at least a few other pockets of gang activity. But, this pocket has been much more violent for at least 6 months by my count. The fact that so much is happening in such a small area should be an advantage to the police.
ReplyDeleteCould we do a "peace parade" with a police presence and march through all the gang hot-spots in Uptown some night?
ReplyDeleteFirst step is to get a recall provision on the books. Second is to exercise it.
ReplyDeleteI'm sure it will improve with the Wilson Yard "Projects".
ReplyDeleteWhat do you have to do to become an alderman??
ReplyDeleteStep 1, Stop Voting for Democrats
ReplyDeleteStep 2, Allow concealed carry permits
But no, that won't happen in our Democratic Utopia that we live in. BTW, this is what Barack Obama believes all of America can be like.
Weis is saying that he will roll out a new approach (of course after the summer, but anyway...) Am I correct in understanding that if there are no arrests then all of this crap is not documented in the system for resource allocation purposes? Do we have to hope for property damage or worse in order to get anyone to acknowledge that gun violence is up and it is only a matter of time before someone is killed or maimed again?? Look at some of the aldermen demanding better services in their neighborhoods because people are getting shot. Why can't Helen Shiller do the same? The issue of police brutality is equally important in those neighborhoods but somehow those aldermen can take a stand against gun violence.
ReplyDeleteWhy is this happening in Uptown when it's not happening in Ravenswood or Lakeview? I think it's correct to point squarely at the alderman, the mayor, the police, and even the governor. But are they simply incompetent or is it more sinister? I ask, because when I lived in Minneapolis, a similar situation was occuring in the neighborhood next to mine. The neighborhood group accused the police of maintaining that neighborhood as a "containment zone"...sort-of an anything-goes area...and that gangs and criminals knew they could do what they wanted there. The neighborhood organization alleged that this was to keep the crime out of adjacent neighborhoods. Could that be happening here?
ReplyDeletewas there a CAPS meeting tonight? any updates?
ReplyDeletei miss uptown dad!
also, no arrests? what did they gangbangers ditch their guns? if yes, please everyone be careful -- we don't want those weapons ending up in the hands of kids...
ReplyDelete"Could that be happening here?"
ReplyDeleteCould be. Probably isn't on purpose. However, Criminals will commit crimes where they are least likely to be caught.
To discharge a firearm in the city of Chicago is a crime. Possession of a firearm in the city of Chicago, noting the few exceptions for off duty cops and military personnel, is a crime.
It's astonishing that police will do NOTHING when a witness points out one of the shooters. Are the police actually admitting that if a gun fight takes place in broad daylight, with multiple 911 calls reporting it, and an actual human being sees the shooters, points out one to the police, that they will DO NOTHING?
There are clear methods to lowering crime. You can't lower crime if the police refuse to question and search a suspect THAT WAS SEEN SHOOTING A GUN.
If it is illegal to own a firearm in Chicago, if it is illegal to discharge a firearm in Chicago, then why the hell is this activity ALLOWED to persist?
The public relations industry will help the Mayor stage an event about getting guns off the street, but these stunts are meaningless when residents attempt to lower crime and police thumb their nose at them. The longer this persists, the stronger the drive in each individual to support conceal and carry laws. I really don't know if conceal and carry would be good in a major city even though I enthusiastically endorse firearms ownership. But right now support for that is very low and a failure to make arrests to take SHOOTERS off the street will rapidly convert supporters of gun control to supporters of individual gun rights.
If possible, I'd like for word to be sent to Uptown_Dad to continue to post his thoughts at uptown update. His posts are valuable to this community.
ReplyDeleteYou had two good posts, murray. Uptown dad knows he is the "glue that holds this place together"---he said so himself! :) He'll be back. If not, I'll start going ultra leftist and he will undoubtedly feel it from his self-imposed timeout and have to come back and defend individualism.
ReplyDeleteAs to Lorie's question, I am not so sure that it is all a sinister containment plan so much as this is friendly and receptive ground for this kind of stuff to be happening. What we've got is an alderman is virulently against any and all attempts to criminalize poverty. Therefore, she chooses to understand what she is seeing as "not too bad" or "the same as it has always been." She, and the larger activist network, are also virulently against police corruption and brutality. When you add to that the fact that Chicago gangs are becoming less geographically dense and the city hasn't figured out how to deal with that, you see more of the stuff we are seeing. Uptown and Rogers Park are the important northside locations for the drug trade. IMHO, the aging former activists who are leading us are increasingly out-of-touch with how to remain true to some social justice sentiments on the one hand but not be overrun by violence on the other hand. Their paternalism and ideology is clouding the issue and preventing effective grassroots efforts to demand solutions. I suppose that could be ok if they had a better plan and were enacting it, but they are not. Undoubtedly the criminal element is wise to where you can have a gun fight on the north side at 2:30 p.m. and not get handcuffed. It is certainly not at North & Clybourn.
"Why is this happening in Uptown when it's not happening in Ravenswood or Lakeview?"
ReplyDeleteBecause we have more public housing than any other area of the city. Public housing breeds crime and violence. Get rid of it, and the crime will go away.
You should have gotten the names of the officers that wouldn't arrest the gangbangers you pointed out, and then sent the names of the officers to the media.
ReplyDeleteShiller wants higher crime, not lower. She is a sociopath just like the gangbangers, sex offenders, and drug dealers walking the streets of Uptown. Nothing is better for her political existence that unsolved murders, shootings, and violent crime.
ReplyDeleteThe reason the police don't do anything is because the a case based on just a witness and no evidence will be thrown out or if the prosecutor is lucky the perp will plead to a misdemeanor. I don't know if any of you know the back log of people awaiting trial at Cook County Jail. I am not saying this is an excuse but this is part of the reason the cops don't do anything if no one is hurt. Personally I wish they would arrest these gang bangers. On the other hand when the cops hit the blocks hard people start complaining about harassment and racial profiling. So as long as the police are in a lose-lose sitiation the law abiding residents of Uptown will also be. I've lived in Uptown since the
ReplyDelete80's when violence and crime was 10 times more prevalent, we have come a long way since then but there is still plenty of room for improvement. I believe it all starts with government subsidized housing.
Maybe we should hit where it would really hurt. All this talk about the proposed 2016 Olympics here and such high crime that can't be controlled while visitors from around the world are expected to attend and spend lots of money? Forget Schiller, I doubt the mayor enjoys embarrassment.
ReplyDeleteI sent an email to the Greg Harris the state representative and Gene Schulter, who is my alderman (living on the west side of Dover has it's advantages) just asking what else can be done and explaining how tired I am - and we all are - of the escalating violence. I will let you know if I hear anything or if they know of any additional avenues we can take to get noticed. The only other thing I can think of is contacting the local news stations and newspapers and trying to get more coverage of the crime in Uptown.
ReplyDeleteI also called the 23rd precinct and I guess they've gotten a lot of complaints about this and it's been escalated to the Super Intendant. I am not sure what that means or if anything will be done, but the next CAPS meeting for beat 2311 is at Truman College on Tuesday, August 5. They are the first Tuesday of the month.
And don't forget about dodging bullets inside their hotel rooms while their children are asleep besides them! It wasn't until I saw that video that I realized how far an unintended bullet can travel.
ReplyDeleteFrom what everyone is telling me here, I guess it's only attempted murder if you hit someone. In our society you get rewarded for bad aim.
ReplyDeleteI mean if you're shooting at someone you are trying to kill them right? But no arrests because they missed. Really?
For those of you who are advocating more individual gun ownership, what would you have done in this particular situation? Run on the street guns ablazing?
ReplyDeleteI am actually in favor of a strict law allowing individual ownership with tight controls and permits. However, I do not think that private individuals should respond to neighborhood violence by pulling out their own piece and entering the action. Private gun ownership is for protection of the individual in the home or business, and is not a replacement for "call 911, then duck and cover" which was the appropriate response in this instance.
I like the idea of contacting the media ... the more outlets, the more attention must be paid!
ReplyDeleteI'm feeling like Howard Beale in the movie "Network" ...'I'M AS MAD AS HELL, AND I'M NOT GOING TO TAKE THIS ANYMORE!'
Well, no arrests mean no crime statistics. Somebody gets to say crime isn't bad here by keeping them artificially low.
ReplyDeleteOfficer said.."No arrest are being made because no one was hurt and no property damaged."
ReplyDeleteWait a minute, did he actually say this? A gun, which I'll bet my Ernie Banks baseball card on was unregistered, is used to shoot on a street in broad daylight, and the cops won't arrest the shooter? And what does he mean "no property damaged"? Those bullets went SOMEWHERE. They don't just vanish, hence they did some damage to something. Either in a building or in a car door or (who knows) in a person that won't be found inside their apartment for several days.
This decision not to act smacks of the backlash by cops against Jody Weis (read the blog "Second City Cop": http://secondcitycop.blogspot.com/
They are pissed at him but ordinary citizens have to pay.
Because we have more public housing than any other area of the city. Public housing breeds crime and violence. Get rid of it, and the crime will go away.
Dumb F*cking Statement of the Day.
From the blog "Second City Cop"
ReplyDelete" You want to back the purveyors of the cult of victimhood? Fine, but most cops aren't going to step up and become victims themselves. We're kind of fond of our houses, our cars, the lifestyle we can afford to provide our families even in the face of you, Corp Counsel and the City Council handing out our tax dollars to a**holes that never would have earned a tenth of that money in the real world doing honest work. Congratulations on getting the police you asked for. Now excuse us while we go do a little more de-policing. Those event numbers won't generate themselves you know."
We're apparently on our own.
We have to ring a loud bell for that, "I'm Watching Too." I tried to call NBC that one night water was spouting from cracks in the street at Leland and Magnolia, and no matter how many calls many of us placed to 911 and 311, it took a fellow to physically walk to the fire department several hours later to get it checked out. Nobody cares about Uptown. But heck, a water main break in Ravenswood or a shooting in Beverly and they're all over it.
ReplyDeletePublic housing breeds crime and violence. Get rid of it, and the crime will go away.
ReplyDeleteI have to disagree with this umbrella statement, as many of my family members across the country live in public housing.
I think the Chicago-centric reality is: "POORLY MANAGED public housing breeds crime and violence." As does an alderman whose attitude toward such events is reflected in the statement by her chief of staff: "The only place there's no crime is heaven."
Vote in a strong law-and-order alderman who'll put pressure on the public housing managers to clean it up, and you'll be amazed at the difference.
"Because we have more public housing than any other area of the city. Public housing breeds crime and violence. Get rid of it, and the crime will go away.
ReplyDeleteDumb F*cking Statement of the Day."
And why is that dumb? Because its true? I mean, does it take a PhD in statistics to see the correlation? Public housing goes in, crime goes through the roof. Just calling me dumb isn't much of an argument. Public housing does not work. We tried, and we failed, and now its time to learn our lesson and move on.
PLEASE READ THIS... It is my understanding that there are only TWO wards that DO NOT require criminal background checks for those in CHA housing... Guess what, Uptown is one of them.
ReplyDeleteThis is the direct responsiblity at the request of Alderman Shiller.
If I am wrong, I challenge someone to prove it. If I am correct, I am curious if we have any legal actions that can be taken in a class action way, not unlike what we are doing with the day job center that is trying to get in on Sheridan?
The problem with this whole thread is that we only have one side of the story. I'm not criticizing the original poster. I think it's important that news of this terrifying incident be shared with the community.
ReplyDeleteWhat's missing is the explanation from the police and prosecuters. Instead we have had 39 posts about a situation we may not have all the facts about.
Make that 38 posts.
----ihatemondays-- knows what he is talking about
Your assessment of public housing is a bit too simplistic, windycityeagle. TSN is right. It is about poorly managed public housing. We've got an alderman who is asleep at the wheel and has proved herself totally incompetent at using her power and her relationships within the community to deal with the violence that is stemming from the drug trade. Uptown's public housing is full of: recent immigrants who are working hard to make a better life for themselves, old and disabled people and poor single family households. Most of these people have nothing to do with the criminal element. They want to live in peace just as posters on this board do.
ReplyDeleteIt is just asinine that we can't even get our alderman to acknowledge that there is a problem much less that it DOES have something to do with friends, relatives and acquaintances of people who live in the subsidized buildings here. If she were actually willing to get off Daley's lap long enough to discuss the REAL reasons why the drug trade has grown and "gone corporate" then she could begin to address the violence without maligning people's right to be housed. (Of course, that would mean pointing a finger at the source of her cash and also her political sympathizers.)
PS--Uptownsuperhero, I think Helen's position is that she does not support criminal checks for public housing recipients so long as people who have market rate housing aren't required to submit as well. I don't know if CHA makes it mandatory elsewhere but not here. How can that be allowed? In either case, though, the troublemakers are often people who are not actually on the lease but friends, partners and relatives who are invited by the leaseholder.
And why is that dumb? Because its true?
ReplyDeleteNo, it's dumb becaue it's NOT true. Public housing doesn't breed crime. NEGLECT of public housing breeds crime. Do some research. When many of the public housing units were built in the city they were actually nice places to live. There were well-maintained building, there were even regular homemaking classes to teach resident about cooking, sewing, etc. What brought on the crime you seem to want to associate with generic public housing is the negligence of the city. Basic repairs went undone, garbage went uncollected, etc., and residents figured if the city didn't care about how they live, why should they. Even to this day, a well-maintained public housing development will always have a much lower crime rate than one that is allowed to deteroriate and become a breeding ground for crime. Besides, there are many neighborhoods in this country where no "public housing" exists, just landlord-controlled slums that have crime problems as well. What does public housing have to do with those places?
How do I know? Our family lived in Robert Taylor in the '60 when you could actually play on the floors and stairwells without fear of abduction or death, when there were actually maintenance men who lived right on the premises and took care of mechanical problems right away, when there were playgrounds and ball field. Remove all of that and THERE is your crime problem. Also, I worked for CHA for five year and had ample access to the history of public housing in Chicago and know pretty much what could have been.
Frotd:
ReplyDeleteI'm serious: go read the blog "Second City Cop", written and contributed to by Chicago cops (mostly anonymously). it won't tell you WHY the shooting occured, but it will give you insight on the police response (or lack of it) after the shooting. That's your police explanation...
Daley is quoted by the Sun-Times saying that the media is what is making the cops "timid." Daley mentions nothing about the contract problems, the disputed number of officers on the payroll, the morale problems surrounding Weis, recent re-orgs in the CPD or the conflicting feedback officers get from aldermen on how they should do their jobs in their wards.
ReplyDeleteI agree 100% with your 11:53 post "man on the street."
ReplyDelete----Man on the Street----
ReplyDeleteIhatemondays knows what he's talking about.
My question on the housing mentioned here is this. (1st - I believe everyone is entitled to a home and everyone needs a place to live.) Many argue that it's the management of the housing. Which is an important part - but as said earlier:
ReplyDelete"In either case, though, the troublemakers are often people who are not actually on the lease but friends, partners and relatives who are invited by the leaseholder."
So doesn't this go along the lines of the people living in the housing? It may not be the person actually living there but someone visiting. And management can't tell you who you can and cannot have in your house. So even if upstanding people are living here, they may not have upstanding visitors. Which in turn could contribute to the violence. Hasn't this been mentioned in regards to other incidents in Uptown? How can you effectively provide housing and keep out the riff raff visitors? Just seems to be somewhat correlated. Any way you cut it the crime and hoodlums in this area lately is disturbing.
Not sure why the cops would say there was no damage to property. A truck parked on Malden had its rear window shot out. I came home to see the cops writing it up. At first I thought the window had been just smashed but then the owner of the vehicle came outside and said it had been shot out.
ReplyDeleteHuh...
ReplyDeleteYou have it EXACTLY right. I heard from the police commissioner first-hand at a CAPS meeting how they determined that the 46th Ward has the, and I quote "Lowest crime compared to all other wards in the city." After the laughter died down, and I asked how they reach that determination, she stated:
Commissioner: "We base crime statitistics on how many arrests are made."
I replied, "Do you take into account how many 911 calls you receive on a daily basis into account?"
Commissioner: "No."
Me: "So, you don't look at how many 911 calls you receive, how many of those were responded to, and as a result of those responses, how many arrests were made to determine actual crime statistics?"
Commissioner: "No."
Me: "Do you happen to have with you the number of 911 calls coming from the 46th Ward on a daily basis to compare with the number of arrests made in the 46th Ward?"
Commissioner: "No."
Me: "Can you explain then, how you think just counting arrests made is a fair portrayal of actual crime statistics in the 46th Ward?"
Commissioner: "Well, because many 911 calls can end up being 'fake' (interrupted by more laughter, hoots of disbelief, etc.) AND because many times when we respond to a 911 call, the perp has already left the area and there wasn't an opportunity to arrest."
When I pressed on them supplying actual 911 call numbers, I was told the didn't have that information with them, but could email it to me. Many of us requested that info be sent to us, and supplied our emails on the sign-up sheet. I haven't heard a peep on that.
So, I would agree with you that perhaps no arrests were made because it does artificially keep the crime-rate lower. I will also argue that Alderman Shiller's aggressive stance against the police in the 46th Ward may be curbing police activity in our nieghborhoods. The gangs and drug dealers know they have a friend in her, so they tend to use the streets in the 46th Ward to handle their business so to speak.
Good and accurate post, farrell. nice to see you back.
ReplyDeleteShooting at someone, on a city street, is Attempt Murder - whether someone is hit or not. The number of counts is usually consistent with the number of shots fired or teh number of potential targets. They could also be charged with offenses such as Unlawful Use of a Weapon (UUW), Unlawful Discharge, Possession of a Firearment, No FOID, Mob Action, Reckless Conduct, Disorderly Conduct - not to mention Violation of Parole/Probation. They should be arrested.
ReplyDeleteMan on the Street,
ReplyDeleteI don't discount your experience at the Robert Taylor Homes, as I've heard many of the same stories from older generations. However, I think there has been a significant cultural shift in the attitudes of many residents who currently live in public housing.
I worked for a non-profit that built playgrounds for many of the CHA resident children. These kind of playgrounds required the community to build them while guided by professional hands. The playgrounds were paid for by corporate sponsorship. All the residents had to do was spend ONE day putting in the FREE playground for their children. I was appalled at one memorable build, how many adults refused to help. They just helped themselves to the free food and drink, sat and smoked, swore and sneered at the company staff who were working to put this in for THEIR children. It was so pathetic that many children that were NOT supposed to be on the build site itself, saw that if they wanted this playground, they would have to make it happen themselves. We had kids as young as six trying to work on the playground build.
We implored the CHA staff to help motivate the residents, and they scoffed, 'Good luck with that." It was obvious that these residents just expected another handout, and weren't willing to do a darn thing, even if this was for the benefit of their own children.
I also live on a block that has buildings designated for CHA housing after the destruction of the Loop projects began. These are beautiful buildings on a nice, residential street, mixed in with condos, apartments and a house or two. Very economically diverse. CHA manages these buildings, and at CAPS meetings, I heard the frustration of the CHA members who were present regarding how difficult it is to maintain these buildings because some of the residents purposely destroy everything in them because they don't care. There was a complaint that gangs were using these buildings to hide from the police because the gates were always open. The CHA put in brand new locks, I saw this first hand walking to the train one day. Within that same week, the doorknobs and locks were gone. Then back, then gone again. The CHA constantly has to replace these locks. They put in bright security lights to keep the alleys well lit so gangbangers couldn't run and hide there. Within days of them going in, they were all broken.
Living next to these buildings I am CONSTANTLY picking up bags of Flaming Hot Cheetos, juice boxes, bottles of pop, empty booze bottles, you name it. One morning I came out to find an entire 24 pack of empty beer cans had been tossed over the gate of my building into the front yard. There is a garbage can less than 10 feet from my building. What is the excuse for this? We planted flowers and came home to find someone had cut the bulbs off the top of them. What is the excuse for that? Is that the responsibility of the CHA owners to handle this, or should that be a matter of the residents themselves having respect for themselves and other people?
There comes a time when people, whether they are poor or not, need to take personal responsibility for themselves instead of pointing fingers at the government, the city and local officials to solve their problems. Being poor is no excuse for being a disrespectful slob. It's no excuse for breaking the law either.
Also, being poor doesn't excuse people from being parents. Now that its nice out, literally every night I'm woken up by a pack of screeching teenagers hanging out on the corner, well past curfew. We call the cops, they come, the kids scatter. The cops leave, they come back. Where are these kids parents/guardians? These are the same people that will bawl on TV, crying how their 'baby' was a GOOD boy or girl, and would never do anything wrong. Yet Junior or Little Miss Sunshine is out running around the city at 2:00 a.m. doing who knows what. When these kids are shot, or end up killing someone else, who do these parents blame? The city. I ask them, where the hell were you?
The problems of our society overall will never end until people accept personal responsibility and stop looking at everyone else to solve their problems for them. In so many ways, our welfare system has fostered this behavior, and the whole system needs to be retailored to provide free assistance to people who TRULY need it (disabled, handicapped, severely mentally ill, elderly, orphans, etc. in other words, people who can't take care of themselves to no fault of their own) - and provide TEMPORARY assistance to those who have fallen on hard times, with an emphasis on job training, budgeting, family planning, education, etc. to get people back on their feet and off welfare. There are people who generation after generation resided in public housing. What is the excuse for this?
As long as people continue to deny responsibility for themselves, and public officials like Helen Shiller and Jesse Jackson back this way of thinking, there will be no change for the better. It will continue to just get worse.
Farrell:
ReplyDeleteI wish I could say that was a surprising conversation. As other recommend, Second City Cop has some startling statistics for the differing numbers this year compared to last. Bangers know where the 'good' areas are.
Also, that conversation just goes to show you what calling 911, as it repeatedly suggested, does. I won't stop calling 911 but such a lackadaisical attitude toward the call is shocking. I see more and more cops in my part of the neighborhood often now. Seems to have calmed down a bit...maybe that's just overly optimistic.
Saskia,
ReplyDeleteThanks for the comment. Although like Uptown Dad, I got tired of being attacked by the trolls on UU and all the negativity. I had to take some time away from it because all the negative stuff happening in Uptown, and the powerlessness we as residents seem to have in changing it, was really stressing me out.
man on the street is right about public housing. Public housing can be an effective garden. But if you neglect to take care of it, ignore its weeds, they will eventually take control and your garden.
ReplyDeleteThose 911 statistics are a great pressure hook. What the community needs is a web kiosk that connects people and their concerns with their public officials and mechanisms of government to better work for them. The block clubs appear to have a solid foundation already in place, but they can work together to promote an online presence.
Not that I actively sought out connecting with these organizations as soon as I moved to Uptown, but I sure as hell should have. There are many people that live in Uptown that are not connected to these organizations that want to be connected to something positive.
Wow, active thread but a long way to go to get to the level of the "Two faces of JPUSA" :)
ReplyDeleteTwo thoughts. One, I agree that individual gun ownership wouldn't solve this incident. I don't think owners should throw open their doors and take shots at gangbangers. However, I do think that the couple mugged by Leland and Clark probably would have been left alone if the muggers thought there was a chance of them packing heat.
Two, I recently saw an emotional and passionate Mayor Daley speaking on TV about the recent shooting death of a young girl (9 yr old?) on the South Side and saying something to the effec that the shooter should be found and killed. Where were these empassioned pleas from Daley or Helen when the Truman college student was shot in cold blood on Broadway? Am I to assume his death was less important? The lack of reporting of Uptown crime is a crime in itself.
Public housing was never meant to be a permanent housing solution for those who are less fortunate. It was to be used as a stepping stone to better you and your families living conditions. They provided a low cost, sometimes free opportunity for families to achieve bigger and better things, i.e. home ownership, job training and education. This worked in the beginning when the mostly Irish, Polish and Italian immigrants and 1st generation americans used public housing to their advantage to get good middle income jobs and save for a home of their own. The mission of public housing has been retarded by those who expect handouts from the government to benefit every aspect of their lives. Where has self responsibility and motivation gone? I guess up in smoke along with the crack rock.
ReplyDeleteDon't forget that that jobs for those with only a high school education severely dried up in the late 70s, there are limited resources for job training/retraining, and new service sector jobs are sometimes a better fit for women than men. Plus, these jobs don't pay a living wage.
ReplyDeleteWe all know the days of a man with a HS education being able to support a wife and family are long over. There are other reasons why public housing became something more than a stepping stone than just a sense of entitlement. Good things to keep in mind, I'd say...
man on the street,
ReplyDeleteI'm sorry, but you're just living in some idealized fantasy world.
Whatever may have been considered the case for public housing in the 1960s is no longer the case today.
Today people who live in public housing tend to think everything should be handed to them and that they are owed everything by the government. They also just do not care about their communities. Look at all the CHA buildings in uptown, there are always piles of trash outside the houses. Do these people need classes in how to use a trashcan? Are they that stupid. Its just a freaking can you put your trash in.
No, they're smart, and they're smart enough to know that they don't have to care and people like you will always take care of them. Check out Broncho Billy park. Its two years old and already three of the toddler toys have been destroyed.
Public housing breeds laziness and contempt for the neighborhood. If these people actually had to work for a living, then they might care about where they live. If they actually had to fix the things that were broken, they might not fix them in the first place. If they actually paid property taxes, they might care about the neighborhood but they don't. Public housing is an absolute failure.
Unfortunately, we're getting more of it at Wilson Yard, and contrary to what man on the street thinks, the crime is going to come with it.
Again, Windy City Eagle, I think we need to differentiate between public housing and poorly managed public housing. Sadly, most of what we see in Uptown is poorly managed.
ReplyDeleteGo other places, and you can't tell the public housing from the private housing. I know this. I have always had relatives living in public housing, and I see how good (clean, well-managed, quiet) it can be.
I've learned quite a few things from living in Uptown, and one is that most people are exactly as responsible as they are required to be.
We all know the days of a man with a HS education being able to support a wife and family are long over.
ReplyDeleteLets be honest, these people don't have high school educations, they can't ever read, and I've heard them and they can barely speak. If you're going to be illeterate then yes, you're going to have problems.
And its definitely hard to get a living wage job when you're drunk all day, as most of the poor in Uptown seem to be.
But don't give me this living wage crap. You can support yourself just fine with a high school education if you choose to work hard. Why do you think all the Mexicans are crossing the border? Because they have some secret love of poverty? Hell no, they know that if they work hard, they're going to make it in the United States.
I know your hardcore liberal beliefs say that with just enough "programs" we could wipe out poverty, but thats just not true. We(as a country) have spent tens of trillions of dollars attempting to eradicate poverty, and its just not happening. I would say thats a good faith effort. We tried, the poor don't care.
I've learned quite a few things from living in Uptown, and one is that most people are exactly as responsible as they are required to be.
ReplyDeleteI think on this, we can agree.
If you're interested in good reading, NYC journalist Steven Malanga wrote a great book about urban politics. Malanga formerly was managing editor at Crain's New York, so he's coming from a particular point of view, but scour the reviews of his book for the many competing perspective reactions to it.
ReplyDeletehttp://www.manhattan-institute.org/newnewleft/reviews.html
Again, Windy City Eagle, I think we need to differentiate between public housing and poorly managed public housing. Sadly, most of what we see in Uptown is poorly managed.
ReplyDeleteSo then, how does one effectively manage public housing? Because I don't necessarily agree with your statement. I just don't see the connection between poor landlords/management and shooting people.
If these people actually had to work for a living...
ReplyDeleteYou are aware that welfare rules have changed and that it is no longer possible to get a check and subsidized housing for years on end? Granted there are a lot of people in Uptown living off of SSI disability checks but the monthly allowances are meager. Littering, loitering and public drinking may come from people on SSI but I'd bet that few if any of these people are behind any of the gun violence.
Does anyone have further information about this?
ReplyDelete"It is my understanding that there are only TWO wards that DO NOT require criminal background checks for those in CHA housing... Guess what, Uptown is one of them."
how does one effectively manage public housing?
ReplyDeleteWell, not corruptly as the CHA did or through patronage politics & corruption as is being pursued now and also in the past in Chicago. (Did you read that Boston Globe article? It was terrific.)
IMHO, effective management needs:
1) Reliable funding streams backed up by accountability on the part of elected leaders.
2) tenant screening and onsite management & maintenance
3) support for tenant organizations
4) integration of the buildings into the surrounding market rate community
5) some kind of healthy community policing organization to improve and facilitate relationships with law enforcement
6) no over-concentration of public housing so that some kind of equilibrium can be established in these mixed income neighborhoods
7) ample availability of skills training programs, daycare, after school youth programs and such so people can use the time they are in public housing to prepare themselves for being self-sufficient.
Hows that for starters?
Saskia, I agree all of these efforts would definitely make a difference for the tenants who do truly want a better life and are willing to work toward it.
ReplyDeletebut I'd bet that few if any of these people are behind any of the gun violence.
ReplyDeleteYou're probably right, they're living off ill-gotten gains from the drug trade. The people in yesterdays gun battle didn't have jobs.
Well, not corruptly as the CHA did or through patronage politics & corruption as is being pursued now and also in the past in Chicago. (Did you read that Boston Globe article? It was terrific.)
I did read that, it didn't exactly make me any more positive on the subject.
Ok, so I suppose then we can admit that my views on public housing are clearly swayed by my experiences in Uptown. If there really are public housing success stories, I'd like to see them. And I'm not talking about anecdotes, I mean real success.
Unfortunately, Chicago is a corrupt city and the CHA is a corrupt organization, so I firmly stand by the statement that public housing doesn't work(at least not where I live).
Taken from the CHA's 2007 Admission and continued occupancy document:
ReplyDelete"The CHA will determine an applicant's suitability for tenancy for the type of unit being offered at the time of screening. All applicants will be screened in accordance with HUD regulations and sound management practices. Screening will include a criminal background, credit and residential history check."
Also,
"The CHA is required to reject applications of certain applicants based on criminal activity or drug-related criminal activity by household memebers."
There's a lot more, and it can all be found on: www.thecha.org under the "plan for transformation" link at the top of the page.
So, if this is not being done in Uptown (and we all know it is not), the CHA is not following it's own rules, or is being told to ignore them by ????
So then, how does one effectively manage public housing?
ReplyDeleteFor starters, you're hands-on. You know who's living there, not (just) whose names are on the lease. You know the conditions of the housing. You know the conditions of the grounds.
A long example of what's good and bad:
The CHA housing near me has changed drastically for the better, and it's because the one-strike rule was enforced. There are no longer gangbangers with chairs in front of the building 24/7. The people who live there have little baskets of hanging flowers and door decorations. They greet me when we pass on the street. One man helped me carry a heavy package from my car to my garage. They are good, house-proud people.
HOWEVER, and it's a big however:
Two of the eight units are vacant because they're uninhabitable. The people who lived there were evicted due to the one-strike rule. The left the place so nasty and broken that no one can live there until it's fixed, and HRC says there's no money in the budget to fix it.
Where was HRC when the criminals were living there? Why didn't they know the condition of the units before the people moved out?
Another problem with not being hands-on: This winter no one ever shoveled the CHA building's sidewalks. The inside sidewalks were shoveled, but not the public ones. When the then-manager from HRC stood up at CAPS, he was angry and said we needed to call him when the sidewalks weren't shoveled, because he was being told they were.
Another sign of bad management. Good management knows what's going on in their buildings.
Another thing good management does is encourage tenants to let them know when other tenants aren't abiding by the rules. My aunts are on the phone in a New York minute when other units are loud, or dirty, or do something that affect the building as a whole.
I'm sure there are many "silent" ways to be good managers, like making yourself known to the community and the police. Well-run organizations don't ever get public attention. The fact that HRC is well-known for its buildings in Uptown isn't a good thing.
The elephant in the room.
ReplyDelete"All applicants will be screened in accordance with HUD regulations"
A lot has changed in Washington. The party that is more friendly to the interests of public housing advocacy now controls Congress. The other party still writes the rules, but they can't write rules the Congress won't fund.
This is worth a visit to HUD.gov, loc.gov, and house.gov.
saskia please spare me the sob stories. We all know how financial aid for college works. If you make under a certain income the government will pay for most of your tuition, if not all of it. I've seen this exploited, by people who register for school and get a full ride then they drop their classes in the first couple weeks and get a refund check from the school. If this is not the epitomy of stupidity I don't know what is. Instead of taking a free ride through college some would rather profit of the good intentions of the government and later complain about their situation. I don't know about you but I am sick and tired of people making excuses for the actions that one makes that keeps them stuck in poverty. I was not given a free ride I had to work my through college & I won't complain about it because it makes me value it that much more.
ReplyDeleteSo people here think that no one is being screened in Uptown for CHA/HRC properties and that no one is losing their housing if someone in the household is found guilty of a crime? I don't know the answer to either of those questions.
ReplyDeleteI hadn't heard that tuition scam. Look, I am not saying that there aren't boneheaded people out there...or scammers...or drunks or drug addicts. What I am saying is that there has been an absolute sustained effort in this country to try to place the troubles of the poor squarely on their own shoulders without any recognition of the larger factors (i.e., changes in the economy) or political decisions (i.e., underfunded programs/initiatives; corporate welfare; geographical isolation of public housing buildings, etc.) that contributed to the mess some people find themselves in. It always has been and always will be the result of public+personal failures and nothing less. If people are really interested in reaching solutions and gaining the critical mass they will need in order to get change on these issues, people need to open their minds to the complexity rather than reducing the discussion to anecdotes of personal failure. It is just not that simple and in my mind awfully cruel to the people who are really trying to help themselves but can't rise up.
ReplyDelete"So people here think that no one is being screened in Uptown for CHA/HRC properties and that no one is losing their housing if someone in the household is found guilty of a crime?"
ReplyDeleteI'd like to get to the bottom of the story. I really don't know if the claim is accurate. It could just be a convenient rumor that draws in Uptown and Englewood as your North and South cousins of unexplained, regularly scheduled, sessions of violence.
All I can add is that sometimes the slightest change in words in the law can create major changes for better or worse.
Public housing was never meant to be a permanent housing solution for those who are less fortunate. It was to be used as a stepping stone to better you and your families living conditions. They provided a low cost, sometimes free opportunity for families to achieve bigger and better things, i.e. home ownership, job training and education. This worked in the beginning when the mostly Irish, Polish and Italian immigrants and 1st generation americans used public housing to their advantage to get good middle income jobs and save for a home of their own.
ReplyDeleteAnd it worked for African Americans too (of which I am one). Like i said, when we lived in public housing (after moving fron NY) most of the families were comprised two working parents. And yes, many like ours, eventually moved away from public housing to single family homes, etc. Your contention of public housing intended to be temporary is correct. But don't limit it to the era of Irish first generation immigrants, etc.
So then, how does one effectively manage public housing? Because I don't necessarily agree with your statement. I just don't see the connection between poor landlords/management and shooting people.
ReplyDeleteWell maintained buildings are monitored a lot closer and better than poorly maintained buidings (naturally). Hence, any crime problems (loitering, unsavory tenants or friends of tenants) are nipped in the bud before they take root. In previous buildings I've lived in (not public housing) where building management was pretty attentive, if there was trouble they took steps to address it, i.e. hiring night doormen, requiring visitors to sign in, etc.
I have lived here many years and every yeat it gets a bigger gang problem. I say that Helen S. is not doing all she can and maybe its time to vote her out next time around and give another a chance. She has been in office too long. Time for a change and stop all this gang madness. Maybe if the gangs move in front of her condo and have some shootouts there then she would start a program to get rid of all the gang problems that uptown has.
ReplyDeleteThe dumbest statement of the day is this!!!
ReplyDeleteand residents figured if the city didn't care about how they live, why should they.
Why should they it's called free housing and an opportunity to get back on your feet!! Did I mention a little self pride...
I note that Shiller will be on CAN-TC two weeks from today ... here's the URL:
ReplyDeletehttp://www.cantv.org/politicalforum.htm
I suggest that as many of us as possible call into the program and ask pointed questions of Shiller so that her words and actions can be documented!
Perhaps we should even call the moderators ahead of time and ask that a 'point/counterpoint' debate be allowed live on TV!!
You can't blame the police for not being more aggresive, every time some punk tussles with a cop or points a gun at one of them and gets shot, the city and aldermen let the cops out to dry, facing firing and/or lawsuits. Especially the aldermen, holding rallies on the west side against "police brutality" while their neighborhoods turn into the wild west. There is a lawless element in this city that does as they will and does not understand basic rules of civility. They only respect force, the force the police used to be able to show. True there is the occasional misuse and scandal, but that is just the nature of any large organization. Basically do we want a police force that can kick some ass when necessary, or a castrated politically correct blindfolded hands tied force.
ReplyDeleteour culture is a violent one. the violence and illegal economy on the street are reflections of the larger violence of our culture and economic and political systems.
ReplyDeletewe all need to change the ways in which we live to solve this problem. not only the people selling drugs or involved in street crime, but all of us who have been brought up in and who support a "get mine first" way of living. what some drug dealers and gang members do on the streets is such a minute relection of what is done in our name collectively everyday on a global level by our government, corporations and way of life. On a global scale, people making nice profits from investments in Boeing, Monsanto, Coca-Cola, etc or simply people who pay federal taxes are in the role of "gang-bangers" or at least suppoters of such activity. not to mention the resource consumption rates of people in the U.S. compared with the rest of the world. the experience of living in uptown where there is some street violence hopefully serves as an eye-opener to some people about OUR culture. It is a violent one.
If most people on this blog (including myself) were poor, poorly educated (thus without the tools to make it in the formal violent economy) and indoctrinated with a selfish, individualistic, capitalistic mentality; anyone of us could be the person on the street shooting a gun to protect gang/drug territory or whatever these people were doing. it's the United Statesian way of life.
putting more police on the street or putting up more cameras is not getting to the root of the problem. i think we need to address and change the individualistic mentality that people in our country and local community are taught and behave according to. Everyone raised in our culture has to struggle with this; poor people, rich people, Latinos, blacks, whites, etc.
Once we do this (and maybe not until we do this) i think we have to begin to make changes structurally in our economy and politics that will see to it that every person has their needs met as well as work that is CONSTRUCTIVE and BENEFICIAL to the individual and the world (so this would exlude work that contributes to the oppression of other people or destruction of the environment) and is done for the inherent value of the work, not just to make some money to buy more stuff.
Of course we also would need a change in political structure that responds to the needs of people, not the wants of people with money and connections.
i know it's difficult for many people to hear this, but as someone who has worked with kids in gangs in Chicago and has served a (short) sentence in a federal prison (with people who had been involved in gang activity), people involved in gangs are not inherently bad people. Labeling them "terrorists" or "trash" or "savages" (all labels i've seen used in this blog over the last few months) really oversimplifies the problem. of course people involved in violent activity need to take responsibilty for their actions, we ALL do, but we also have to look at the structural situations that lead to these problems...and it's wider than just public housing and how it's managed.
saskia, in response to your first post about why it's so hard to get consensus about gun violence, i think pretty much everyone agrees with you that gun violence is a serious problem, but given the tone of some of the posts on this blog, is it really a surprise to you that many residents and activists in Uptown would be hesitant to work together with many of the people who post here?
We should contact the investigative hotline numbers of the local news networks to get some media attention about the police refusing to make arrests with eyewitness identification of gangbangers engaging in a shoot out at 3:30 in the afternoon on Wilson. That is absolutely offensive and frightening.
ReplyDeleteI just noted the Fox News Chicago Investigative Tip Line number - 312.565.8076. If they get enough calls, I would imagine they would be keen to investigate. I am going to call right now.
VERY CONCERNING: I just called both the 23rd and 19th district police stations and both said that nothing happened yesterday on Wilson. There are no reports of a shooting and no information was passed on to the night shift yesterday. Is this how screwed up this is, that gangsters engage in a shootout in broad daylight and there is not even a report filed????!!! No wonder the crime stats for Uptown drastically under represent the violence in the streets!
ReplyDeleteRon: A Thoughtful post. Thank you.
ReplyDeleteI do not think UU readers are opposed to new strategies. I do think there will be hesitations in hearing out new strategies that begin with gangs of a different nature in Boeing and Coca-Cola.
Frankly, I'd love to trade goods and services with reformed gang members. I'd really prefer we not trade bullets in motion.
Hello everyone. I am absolutely disgusted by this latest tidbit of information on the police reaction to witness accounts. However, I am not at all surprised. I have witnessed, as well as videotaped Uptown Lawd gang members on my street (Windsor), engaging in large narcotics deals at all hours of the day and night. (Anytime from 5 PM to about 3 AM in the morning). I have audio and visual evidence of these members planning an imminent murder. These videos were accumulated on or about the time period of the drive -bys tht occurred directly in front of my condo, taking out the windshield of someone's car, and the shooting and killing of a man on N Sheridan at the beginning of the summer. I called and invited two different sergeants from the 23d district to view these videotapes on several different occasions, as I was told that they never have direct evidence of narcotics activity on my street, or exact description of the gang members. I have yet to be taken up on this offer. For about a two week perod of time, I was told that my street was considered a "hot spot", and that units would be dispatched regularly. However, for about 7 weeks, there has not been a patrol car on my street, and the gang activity has re-activated. I called the direct line of one of the sergeants to inform him of the recent activity, which includes smashing peoples cars that are parked on the street (I have video of this as well), throwing M-80's at people walking down the street (on a VERY narrow street), throwing glass beer bottles at people on the street, and driving down the street, dumping weeks worth of garbage onto the front porches of the condo owners. I was told to call 911 to report ALL of this behavior, as WEIS had an intiative for curfews, hot spots, loitering, vandalism, assault, etc. My neighbors and I had to call 5 times this last week--his car has been demolished over the last month by baseball bats. NOT ONCE did a police squad respond to my calls. THIS is where a firearm would come in handy. As far as the person who said that Barack Obama wants more of the same--think again my friend--why do you think Jesse Jackson got so much flack for making his usual Jackass comments--because Obama believes that people need to take personal responsibiity for themselves. I'm a Democrat--and I sure as hell wouldn't run things the way this clown Shiller does. It has nothing to do with Democrat and Republican...
ReplyDeleteTo Ron Durham: I agree with some of what you are stating. We are all looking for a band-aid to cover a festering sore, instead of looking at a preventative solution to the social ills that got these kids in the violent place that they are in. Until these issues are dealt with as a whole, the only immediate solution is to increase the fighting power on the opposing side. About the time that I saw teh increase in gang activity on my street this summer, I became so frustrated with the moms that were taking their children on their gang excursions that I went to the Clarendon Park Center to see what kind of after school tutoring services I could provide for the kids who wander around the streets at all hours of the day and night. Apparently, there was no interest in this kind of volunteer effort.
ReplyDeleteBut the gang members who are selling narcotics are feeding into the American System of greed more than anyone else I know. Most of them, if not all, are making more money than I did last year, when I had a full time job. I am unemployed this year, and, luckily, can still pay my mortgage for a few months without going on unemployment. These gusy are making money, killing people, wounding people, bringing my property values down by throwing garbage and glass bottles on the street, keeping me awake at night by loitering in front of my bedroom window at all hours every night, and I'll be DAMNED if I'll be responsible for doing ANOTHER GODDAMNED thing for them...No--I think that when I get a new full-time job, I'll go back to teaching illiterate adults how to read at the Anixter Center. Honest, hard working adults with disabilities, like my last student Jermane, who worked three jobs on the South Side during the day, and then took a train to the North Side to learn how to read and write. That's called personal accountability. No more whining. No more complaining. These gang members are pieces of S@@@@. Sorry.
melissa -- that's horrible that you have to live like that. have you thought about contacting the media? esp. with your footage?
ReplyDeletemelissa - you should go to the caps meetings that are held the first wednesday of every month at the clarendon field house. It's not going to stop anything, but at least you can confront the cops that walk our beat.
ReplyDeleteThe dumbest statement of the day is this!!!
ReplyDeleteand residents figured if the city didn't care about how they live, why should they.
Why should they it's called free housing and an opportunity to get back on your feet!! Did I mention a little self pride...
your definition of "self pride" is different from someone else's, if you hadn't noticed. Where you might get "self pride" from cutting your lawn or picking up trash around your house, someone else might get it from buying a new pair of Nikes or the latest jeans and to hell with the lawn or garbage.
See how that works?
Melissa - This is terrible. Can you attend the beat 2311 CAPS meeting at Truman College on Tuesday, August 5? Can you bring any of this footage to the meeting to show them in person?
ReplyDeleteI also agree with contacting the media. I think the police, city, etc. will be more apt to do something if it's being filmed and reported on.
Man on the Street
ReplyDelete"Where you might get "self pride" from cutting your lawn or picking up trash around your house, someone else might get it from buying a new pair of Nikes or the latest jeans and to hell with the lawn or garbage.
See how that works?"
Yes, and you are correct. Instead of paying for a place to live you have folks that take advantage of the system and go out and buy $200 jeans and $200 shoes when they should be paying for a roof over their head!!!
But don't worry I will continue to pick up the empty bottles, chip bags, pay my mortgage and of course my taxes so others can get a free ride.
fyi: The $200 shoes are fakes. Not all of them, but lots of them. You can get them for $35 around the city. They look just like real Jordans.
ReplyDeleteHi guys. This is Melissa. I did attend my first CAPS meeting about two months ago, and vowed I would never return. This was two days after the drive - by in front of my place, and I had called out one of the officers at the "uptown" meeting that took place on Sunnyside. Looking back, I agree I was a little hot-headed about calling him out, but this was after many, many attempts by my neighbors and myslef to get some peace on our street. At that time, we could not even walk out of our front gate without being violently confronted. It has gotten a little bettr since I have raised some heck with the 23d district. However, getting back to that particular meeeting, which I attended, and which followed the Sunnyside gathering (and by which time the police sargeant and I were on very civil footing), I was consistently verbally attacked by one of the CAPS members for speaking my mind about the police lack of response in our neighborhood. In fact, the officer who was presenting self-defense techniques during the meeting had to come over and ask her to calm down. Additionally, I did not feel that the real issues of gun warfare were being dealt with at teh meeting, as we were being taught physical self defense moves. These gang members approached my neighbors with knifes and guns. They have shoot outs on our street, they do not try to choke us like street thugs. We need real answers. However, I was not going to dare bring it up at the meeting, for fear of being physically attacked by the girl who was berating me the entire time, as well as her friend who joined in.
ReplyDeleteOh--one more thing about the videos--yes -I did write channel 7's "Investigation" team regarding the problem and the videos that were in my possession. I have never received a response.
ReplyDeleteI have thought about posting them on U-Tube, and entitling them "Come One Come All to the City of Dreams for the 2016 Olympics"
But really, I don't know if I can risk creating any more controversy for myself...
Even though the housing market is in the dumps, it may be wise to sell now before they start building the Wilson Yard "projects" and property values drop even more.
ReplyDeleteIt's just sad to see a neighborhood with such potential be kept from reaching this potential from a select few (gangbangers, alderman, Daley, etc.).
Time to head west to Ravenswood!
Melissa: Can you email me? I may be able to assist you. Let's talk.
ReplyDeletecurlyssoul - at - gmail.com
Melissa-
ReplyDeleteI thoroughly enjoy your idea about posting the videos on YouTube. I encourage you to do so. Something has to be done. And it appears... from reading this and hearing of other situations and how they were dealt with… that nothing is going to be done about it.
So why not send everything we've got to the media? If the police or local government are going to sit by and do nothing about it what other choice do we have? I MEAN… YOU DON'T ARREST SOMEONE WHO OPENED FIRE IN BROAD DAYLIGHT?!?! Then we, the residents of Uptown need to try an alternate venue. I think, quite possibly, that the media may be the only solution.
I've lived in Uptown/Chicago/IL for a year and a half now and it's not the first time I've heard something like this going relatively unmentioned or basically ignored.
I remember months back when someone was shot out in front of the Wilson Red Line stop (which I take to work every day), also in broad daylight, and it was basically brushed under the rug like nothing happened. I heard about it because I stopped in at my local watering hole (Nick's on Wilson), and the bartender gave me the heads up as to why there were police cars littering the corner of Broadway and Wilson. Upon hearing this I scoured the internet, looking for additional information… motives… if the victim survived… Etc… and I could not find a single shred of information on any of the local news sites. It got to the point where I e-mailed one of them (that had broadcasted a blurb about the incident) and received a response along the lines of 'someone was shot… that's about it'. It seems like crime is constantly brushed under the rug and ignored.
I don't know how an illegal loaded gun can be discharged in a public place in the middle of the afternoon with an eye witness willing to testify and nary even a slap on the wrist. That sounds like the most ludicrous thing I’ve ever heard... and my ears have been around!
I think the media may be our only outlet. It might be a sort of self-deprecating way to accomplish anything… making a spectacle of our ‘quaint’ neighborhood… but if this just gets brushed under the rug it only leaves the door open for it to happen again and this shooting happened right up the block from me... Thankfully I was at work…
This infuriates me.
I'd love to help this neighborhood because as much ugliness as I've seen since I've moved here... I've seen a lot of beauty and it tears me up that it's getting beaten and abused.
I don't know but maybe it is time to do another rally at either the police station or down at city hall? The media seem primed to do some coverage on one given what has been in the news lately. The fact that this would be the second rally coming from one neighborhood this summer might also make it interesting. Just throwing the suggestion out there...
ReplyDeleteI'm fired up.. really heated about this.
ReplyDeleteI'm in.
I'm ready to make a difference and stop letting this #%$@# go down in my neighborhood.
Melissa, over 75 people witnessed your behavior at the Sunnyside Mall Meet and Greet and later at Clarendon Prk fieldhouse. Your version of reality is very different from what we witnessed. You might want to get to a "meeting".
ReplyDeleteIf Melissa really has this video, she should send it to the media with her story of no police action, as well as posting on youtube.
ReplyDeleteReally, why hold onto it (if you have it) and keep everyone in the dark.
William, your best bet to get information about incidents like the shooting at the Wilson El is from your district office or at your local CAPS meeting. We talked about this case at several meetings. The "victim" failed to press charges. This happens a lot when its gangbanger against gangbanger.
ReplyDeleteto "na counselor" and those who inquired about the video: it is interesting that you (na counselor)noted that 75 people "witnessed" my "behavior" at the clarendon meeting after the Sunnyside meeting. That's very interesting. Just what behavior did those people at the Clarendon meeting witness, considering I sat in the back and didn't say a word? In fact, the CAPS girl who disagreed with me calling out Sergeant Silva at the Sunnyside meeting (which I admitted on THIS post was overly hotheaded), would not stop turning around in her seat and accosting me the entire time. Her behavior at the meeting, in fact, caused the officer who was making a presentation to ask her to quiet down. However, if there had been a drive by shooting in front of your bedroom window the night before the Sunnyside meeting, after weeks of trying to get the police to respond to the gang violence outside of your front door, you do not know how you would have reacted to the police at the Sunnyside meeting: especially when they stated that group neighborhood meetings in the day were going to be the solution to the violence. It's people like you who make it difficult for people to share information on this site. Also, if you're a CAPS member, let me remind you that you are not a member of the police force, so quit taking it as a personal attack that I utilized my first amendment right to free speech. Someone has to speak up about the lack of police response to these problems. At the same time, when there is prompt police response, we also have to show our support and thanks, which I have done. I have the phone number of a sergeant with whom I work very closely on a number of matters.
ReplyDeleteAs far as the videos are concerned, I have written one of the news stations, but they have not responded. I've had a difficult time getting the police to view them for months now. I'm not going to risk my professional life, and put myself on the line any further by putting these on U Tube as I've explained at this time. Especially with the personal attacks I've already received by people like the CAPS representative at the Clarendon Park meeting (na counselor's friend).
AS AN ATTORNEY I CAUTION NA COUNSELOR AGAINST telling people on this site that the police did not arrest the drive-by Wilson shooter on Wilson. This is totally false factually and legally. PS on the CAPS meetings-especially to na counselor: There seems to be a heck of a lot of CAPS meetings going on-and yes--I have a few friends who have informed me as to what has taken place at the last few, but VERY LITTLE in the way of decreased crime statistics, police enforcement, motivation, or innovative ideas in Uptown. In fact, violent crime and gang activity has only been on the rise in the last month in our area. Nothing is going to change unless people stop "yessing" the 23d district, believing everything they tell you, continue NOT asking the RIGHT kinds of questions, not just "Officer, how do I get out of a stranglehold"? But the CAPS people are afraid to challenge ANYTHING they're told. That's why nothing EVER changes. The sergeant told us at the last meeting that noone wants to file a report on criminal activity, and that's why they won't arrest. That was totally false. My neighbors and I have called the police in when we have witnessed drug deals, his car and neighbors cars were getting smashed with baseball bats, etc., and were willing to fill out complaints. They would not come over to take a report. The shoot-out on wilson had more than just one "victim". As a LAWYER myself, I caution you against telling others on this site WHY the police did not make an arrest. There are other criminal charges that could have been filed, and other witnesses who wanted to give statements.
ReplyDeleteMelissa: Lets talk. I can help you make BETTER contacts with members of the media.
ReplyDeletecurlyssoul - at - gmail.com